Wife of former KISS drummer releases 2nd printing of "Sealed with a KISS", featuring additional photos and stories.
By Peter Lindblad
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| Lydia and Peter Criss -The 70s |
In her book, "Sealed with a KISS", Lydia relates how she stood by Peter and
provided financial support as he attempted to jump start his music career with
long-forgotten bands such as Nautilus, the Sounds of Soul, Lips, The
Barracudas, and Chelsea. Then, along came Gene Simmons and Paul Stanley,
members of Wicked Lester when their paths crossed with Peter’s. It was Simmons
who answered Peter’s ad looking for musicians playing original music who needed
an experienced drummer. Soon after, KISS was born.
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| "Sealed with a Kiss" by Lydia Criss |
This is Part 1 of our interview with Lydia Criss.
Looking at the photos
from the early years, you and Peter were a stylish couple back then.
Lydia Criss: Oh,
we were the two that were more stylish than the rest. We were the two dressers.
You know what it is? My mother was a seamstress. So, she made him a lot of his
jackets. She made me most of
my clothes. I did buy a lot, but she did make a lot, too. So my mother was a big help for me because my mother would get mad at me if I’d spend $50 on a blouse. [I’d say,] “Okay then, I’ll find a pattern and material for us and you’ll make it for us.” And she’d make it … for $10 (laughs) or maybe $5 even. That’s why she made my wedding gown. She made all the bridesmaids’ [gowns]. She was amazing.
my clothes. I did buy a lot, but she did make a lot, too. So my mother was a big help for me because my mother would get mad at me if I’d spend $50 on a blouse. [I’d say,] “Okay then, I’ll find a pattern and material for us and you’ll make it for us.” And she’d make it … for $10 (laughs) or maybe $5 even. That’s why she made my wedding gown. She made all the bridesmaids’ [gowns]. She was amazing.
But you made stuff,
too, right? I think there was a KISS jacket [in the book] with what looked like
rhinestones on the back …
LC: I made that.
That’s a regular denim jacket that I bought in the store. And I did everything
on that. I’m actually selling that in the auction, which I said, “Why am I
doing this?” But people said to me it’s because you’re never going to wear it
and if you really, really, really … first of all, it looks like it’s made for a
child. I was so small then. And I just said, “You know what? If you ever want
something like that again, you can just make another one.” And I did, because I
have all the stuff. It just takes time. It is rhinestones, and I have the
rhinestones,
I have the studs … I have all that stuff. And I used to like say
if I was sitting at home doing nothing one night, I would do like the left side
of the jacket, and then I would make sure the right side [was done] so I could
wear the jacket. And then, I was bad, because I would keep adding but I would
always add balance. You know, I would always make the right and the left … you
know, I wouldn’t work on it if I could only make half a side, where I’d do just
one side and not the other side. The jacket was always wearable, but it just
kept getting more and more glitter – more bling to it (laughs).
So much of KISS’s
clothing and stage show early on was put together in do-it-yourself fashion,
with everybody pulling together. It must have been thrilling to be a part of
it. Talk about how their look evolved.
LC: Yeah, in the
beginning, my mother actually made some of his stuff, some of his jackets, like
there’s a picture of him in the loft – it’s one my lithographs, I’m not sure if
you’re familiar with that. It’s a picture of all four of them back in the loft,
and it’s not even their loft. It’s the Bleeker Street loft, which was The
Brats’ [loft]. You know, The Brats, which was a band from New York. It was
their loft. And it was way before [famed KISS manager Bill] Aucoin, and they
were all dressed in different things. Ace’s mother made him a shirt, and
Peter’s mother made him a shirt. I made him his hot pants and my mother made
him the jacket. My mother made a lot of his stuff in the early days, too, but
not once it came to Aucoin. When Aucoin stepped in, [everything] was done by a
professional – a real professional.
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| KISS - Backstage at the Bleeker Street Loft - June 1, 1973 Lydia Criss |
I know you made that
KISS shirt that’s in the book, too. Is that your favorite piece?
LC: Yeah, believe
it or not, I sold that in the previous auction. Oh, the KISS shirt. I made one
for Peter. I made one for Gene. I used to make them for his family. You know
what it is? I had a stencil that was used for the bass drum. And I used it on
the shirt. And I just used glue and glitter. It was so easy to make.
Oh, yeah.
LC: Yeah, I mean
it was just put the stencil on, put the glue on and then put on the glitter and
it was done. And it went through the wash. That’s why it looks like it does. It
looks like that stuff is coming off.
It gave it kind of a
cool distressed look.
LC: Yeah.
What was the hardest
thing about doing this book?
LC: The memories,
the memories. You know, I’m an organization freak. I’m a Scorpio, so you know,
we’re like really organized. I had to have everything right. I had to have it
in order. In the book, there are three sections: there’s before KISS, KISS, and
then after KISS. But the hardest part was having to deal with some of the
things that were painful at the time, and they became painful again. There were
times where I would sit and read. I did my manuscript many, many years before I
decided to [publish it]. I mean, I decided to do the book, but my publisher
went bankrupt. He was a small-time guy, and he went bankrupt, and I got all my
stuff back. That was basically in the ‘90s. I had started that at the end of
the ‘90s … like ’99 I think I had given my manuscript over to him. And then he
didn’t do anything, so in 2004, I got everything back, and that’s when I became
serious, when Jacques van Gool of Backstage Auctions did the auction. And I
just said, “Well, what do I need all this stuff for? It’s going to be in my
book. I can always look at it in my book. I can’t hold it physically, but it’s
in my book.” So, basically, I sold everything and I wanted to do the book, but
the thing that really, really hurt was when I’d sit home at night – because I
didn’t have editors at the time; I’d have editors later on, but at the
beginning I just had a manuscript and then the editors kind of went through the
manuscript, and they would correct things. Not much though. Believe it or not,
they were surprised that I wrote my book. They just corrected like punctuation
and grammar and stuff like that, and maybe a little bit of the things we fought
about, like say they’d say something happened this way, I would say it happened
that way. But they weren’t there. I was there. But they’re talking to other
people and other people are telling them, “Well, you know, no it was Sean
Delaney.” And I’d say, “No it wasn’t. It was Neil Bogart.” Or, they’re saying
it’s Neil Bogart, and I’m saying, “No, it was Sean Delaney.” That was one thing
we disagreed with, but the thing is, we decided to word it where it says we
disagree: “Well, I feel it happened this way. Other people feel it happened
this way.” But anyway, the hard parts … you know, getting divorced, finding
letters where Peter is cheating on me, having to have an abortion … those are
the things. I would sit at night, and you know, after I’d be on the computer
all day, working on the book, I’d sit at night, on my couch, with a little
light on, and I’d read all their corrections, and I’m telling you, sometimes
I’d be hysterical, crying, and then a paragraph later, I’d be hysterical,
laughing.
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| The Big Day |
What was it do you
think that originally attracted you to Peter?
LC: His
character, his personality. Anyone that knows Peter from those days will tell
you Peter was a great guy – especially when he wanted to be a great guy. Like,
he’s a schizophrenic or he’s got split personalities, but Peter had something
magical about him. It was definitely not his looks that attracted me. I wasn’t
attracted to that, and he surely didn’t have money. So, it was definitely his
personality.
What were your dates
like? He seems like he’d be a fun date.
LC: We really
wouldn’t do much. We would go to friends’ houses, we would go to the Village,
we would go to Central Park … maybe we’d go to the movies. We didn’t really
have like [dates]. I mean, he didn’t take me out to dinner much. Like I said,
he didn’t have money. I was still living at home. I couldn’t cook, so I wasn’t
cooking him dinners. He had a friend who lived in my neighborhood, Jerry Nolan,
his best friend, who was the drummer for the New York Dolls. Coincidentally, he
lived in my neighborhood, and Peter would sleep over and stay over there, or
we’d go over and hang out at Jerry’s. Or, most of the time, we’d go to see
Peter play.
At first, you didn’t
think much about dating a musician. Everybody always says how tough it is. Was
it difficult for the two of you early on?
LC: I really
wasn’t even aware what went on dating a musician or what went into that. I
dated a sailor before him, but before that … I only had two boyfriends before
him, and before that there was a guy, but we were only 16, so we didn’t work –
we were like still going to school. And so, I didn’t know what it was like to
date a musician. I mean, I thought it was okay at the time. Then, when I read
some of his book, I was definitely … the wool was being pulled over my eyes.
And that’s another thing that hurt, reading his book. I’m sure him reading my
book hurt also. And I think that’s his way of getting back or getting even with
me, ‘cause that’s how Peter is. Peter can be a real sweetheart in front of you,
but he can stab you in the back when you’re not looking.
You write about some
of the financial issues you had while Peter tried to get his music career
going.
LC: I mean I
worked; he didn’t work. You know what he paid for? He paid for his drugs, and
he paid for some of the clothes he might have bought and maybe the gifts for
his family. But I paid all the household bills – you know, for all the
furniture. I paid for the vacations. I paid for our honeymoon. I paid for our
wedding. Even though the wedding – you get gifts and it pays for itself – but I
initially paid for the wedding. But I paid for the honeymoon … you know what he
used to do, which I found out later also? And I’m talking about maybe two years
ago, I might have found out. He was making $50 a night and he’d tell me he’d
only be making $35 or he’d only be making $25. The guy that worked with him,
the guitar player, he says, “We never made less than $50 a night.” I’ve got
records. I’ve got records that I kept, and it’s in a composition notebook – the
picture of the book. But I kept records of all the jobs he worked and what
salary he came home with. And either he was spending it on girlfriends or he
was spending it on drugs. So that’s another thing that I found out way later,
way after I was divorced – like 25 years after I was divorced.
Was there a low point
early on with Peter where you asked yourself, is this ever going to get any
better or perhaps Peter isn’t going to make it?
LC: Not really,
because we were only married two years when he met KISS, when he met Gene and
Paul. He met them in ’72. So that was only two years. Two years is nothing. There
was a point where we had just moved to our second apartment, I was kept busy
with moving, working every day; then, I’d sell Avon during the day at my job,
and then I’d also make macramé – different things, chokers, belts, bracelets,
and I would sell them, you know, to supplement the income. So, there was none
from him, or very little.
Pre-Kiss, did you
think any of the bands he was in up to that point was going to be big?
LC: Chelsea.
Chelsea was the only one, because they had a record deal. Everybody else did
cover songs, so they weren’t looking for a deal. There was a time when Peter
did do something. He was in a contest at the Brooklyn Academy of Music that
they won. And they got a record deal, but it didn’t do anything – like one
single I think they did. It really went nowhere. But Chelsea … at least Chelsea
had an album. They worked with some pretty important people at the time, like
the producers and the engineers and stuff like that. I had no idea who these
people were, and eventually, years later, you realize they were somebody. Even
Eddie Kramer was somewhere involved in there. I’m not sure how, and there was
different people. And I thought that might have made it, even though that
wasn’t my type of music, but at least when he joined KISS, at one point it got
to the point where he would just … working with Stan Penridge and they were
just doing drugs, it was back to the old days where they were just doing cover
songs and some original stuff back in the same old clubs. He was playing, you
know, the King’s Lounge, like when he was with some other bands earlier than
when he was with Stan, it was called Lips. And he had played the King’s Lounge
with Joey Lucenti. He was in a band with him when KISS came to audition Peter …
not audition, because Peter would audition at the loft, but they wanted to see
him play with the band, so they came to see him at the King’s Lounge. He played
with a few bands in that one club, not too far from where I used to live in
Brooklyn.
Meeting the men from
Wicked Lester, you talked about how shabbily they dressed, but they had big
plans. Did you sense right away that this was going to be something different
for Peter?
LC: Well, when I
saw their attitude and their professionalism … I mean, they were unprofessional
in certain ways and were professional in other ways – you know, trying to bust
Peter’s balls in flirting with me. But I saw right through that. But I just
said, I like the songs; I loved “She” and “Deuce” and there were just songs
where I just said, “Wow! This is more my style than Chelsea.”
Even at that time it
seemed like they had grand designs on putting together a big stage show, huh?
LC: Um, I’m not
sure if they had that in mind. I think Sean Delaney was that … that was all
Sean Delaney’s ideas, from what I can remember. You know, I’m sure once they
realized there’s money … [that] you could do something with a lot of money then
you’re not limited. Then your mind expands and you can see things you never
thought you’d be able to do. I don’t think they saw that in the early days.
They just wanted to be big, like … yeah, The Beatles were big, but they didn’t
have the stage that KISS had. They were basically all Beatles fans, so that’s
what they were looking at. Ace was a Jimi Hendrix fan, so, you know, Jimi
Hendrix didn’t have anything elaborate. In those days, it was basically [David]
Bowie, Alice Cooper and the New York Dolls that they took everything from. And
Sean Delaney incorporated it and went even further.
The Coventry was
where the band got its start. It wasn’t an auspicious beginning for them. What
do you remember about the place and those first shows?
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| KISS - Coventry Show Flier |
LC: The Coventry
was very small. It was a neighborhood club, but it was the club to play. It was
right over the bridge from Manhattan in Queens, and that’s where the Dolls
played, that’s where there were bands like Luger and Street Punk … with Street
Punk and Luger, [they] eventually played with them at the Diplomat. I think the
Brats played at the Coventry. That was the place to play. And Gene and Paul
went and talked to the owner and got a gig. I think it was Paul. I’m not even
sure it was Gene, but I think Paul.
I thought it was
interesting where one of the pictures of KISS playing at 54 Bleeker Street with
the Brats showed them behind what looked like a rope that was separating the
band from the crowd.
LC: I know
(laughs). I know. We thought it was hard to believe then (laughs).
It was interesting
that the Brats were holding their own shows there.
LC: You know, I’m
still friends with Dominique, the lead singer; he calls himself Keith West. We
always knew him as Dom from The Brats. I’m still friends with him. He still
lives on the same block as my boyfriend [Richie Fontana, who used to play in
Piper with Billy Squier].
Oh, is that right?
LC: Yeah. We live
in the same housing … it’s really nice like Tudor-type houses out in Queens,
and they have the same management company that manages the houses. It’s not low
housing. It’s expensive. But they live about three doors down from each other.
Is that place still
around, that 54 Bleeker Street loft?
LC: It’s still
there. I don’t know what’s being held there, but I actually … somebody asked me
about that like, “What’s the number? I [went] on Bleeker Street and I can’t
find anything.” I’m going, “You’re not going to find anything. It looks like a
doorway.” So, I gave her the number, 54.
I wanted to ask you
about some of the big events in your life and that of KISS, starting with the
Casablanca launch party. That looks like it a great time.
LC: Oh, it really
was. I flew out with Gene’s girlfriend, Jan. I think we were staying at the
Chateau Marmont at the time. And we shared a room with Gene. And my mother made
me that outfit [shown in the book]. Like I said, she was a seamstress. She made
the black velvet jacket. I made the hot pants. She would make the tops and I
would make the bottoms. They’re easy to make – for girls they’re easy, not for
guys. But I used to make the same pants for Peter, just bigger. I mean, it
wasn’t done professionally, but it looked good. Anyway, I would make the
bottoms, and she made the tops, and she made me a vest, a silver lame like vest
and a bow tie, and it looked like a tuxedo. And I rented a top hat, and I
remember meeting David Janssen [who starred in the television series “The
Fugitive”] and Alice Cooper. I met Alice Cooper that night. That was amazing.
Oh, and the other thing about that night was that I was drinking Black
Russians, and that’s not the thing to drink on an empty stomach, ‘cause I don’t
remember food being there. I was drinking Black Russians and all I remember is
the limo driver carrying me out over his shoulder, both of us hysterically
laughing. I wound up staying in the limo while everyone went out to have
something to eat … and well, see there wasn’t any food. Everybody went into
restaurant, and I stayed in the limo ‘cause I was too bombed. And the next day,
I stayed in my room until about 6 o’clock at night. I could not get out of bed.
I should have eaten before. I finally ended up having some soup at around 8
o’clock at night.
They really did it up
that night.
LC: It was great.
I have some pictures. I did take pictures. They didn’t come out that great,
because I had a little tiny Insta-Matic camera. It wasn’t anything professional.
And I’m just glad I got something, but it wasn’t what I would have liked.
Yeah, because they
really did it up. They had a guy dressed like Humphrey Bogart …
LC: Oh yeah. Oh
yeah. I have pictures of him. I think I put that in the book … they had a fake
camel, and there were all these gambling tables, like a casino, but it was
old-fashioned looking, like from “Casablanca.” It was amazing. Neil Bogart even
dressed as Humphrey Bogart, and he was wearing Humphrey Bogart’s real jacket
[from the movie]. So it was amazing. And then the offices of Casablanca … there
were palm trees and camels and arched doorways … they made it all look like the
Middle East (laughs).
What do you remember
about some of the shows KISS would play in Detroit? That was the town that was
really into KISS.
LC: Above all,
they loved the band. They just loved them. I don’t know why, but maybe because
of “Detroit Rock City,” or maybe they did “Detroit Rock City” because they’d
loved them there. I don’t know which came first, the chicken or the egg. But for
some reason … the promoter really liked them. I think it was Steve Glantz, who
was the promoter. Him and Bill Aucoin got along great, and they booked them there
a lot. And that’s kind of where they really made their mark. You know, they
played the Michigan Palace first, and I think they even played with Aerosmith
at one point. They played with Mott the Hoople at one point. It was
interesting. It was really interesting how they climbed the ladder. And then
they’re playing Cobo Hall, and then they decided to do a live album, with the
remote trucks outside to capture it, to tape it. And it was a great place to do
that, because it was a place where they were really loved.
Did it seem like it
was … I don’t want to say an overnight success, but that it was moving quickly
for KISS at that point?
LC: Well, let’s
see, I supported Peter for six years, and then three years before we got
married, so nine years. It wasn’t an overnight success (laughs). Let’s see … we
met in ’66, and then Alive! went gold
in ’75, so that’s nine years. So, it was about time. At that time when it
happened, it was a great point. Things were starting to happen. Peter would
come home and say kids are like jumping on the limos … and the other thing is,
they had limos (laughs)! In the early days, KISS would be pulling up [to
venues] in a station wagon (laughs). I don’t remember really them being in tour
buses in those days. They would fly everywhere. They would fly and that was one
of the other amazing things, that we would just ask for a plane ticket and we’d
get it, you know. It was like, whoa. Call the travel agent (laughs).
What do you remember from that first show at Madison Square Garden?
LC: Madison
Square Garden, of course, touched my heart in a way no other venue could,
because I grew up there. I saw the [Concert for] Bangladesh there, you know,
George Harrison. I saw some of the biggest acts I will ever see at Madison
Square Garden. And just to be able to see … I mean, the Rolling Stones were at
the Garden.
You saw everyone.
LC: I saw Bianca
Jagger. There was Bianca Jagger, and I was sitting in the same seats where she
was sitting when the Rolling Stones played. And everybody asks me, “What was
the best thing in your KISS life?” There’s not one; there are three. Madison
Square Garden is one of them, the People’s Choice Awards was the other, and
going to Japan was the other. At Madison Square Garden, I stood on the stage
and there were people that knew my name and were calling me. I would go on the
stage before the band, and I actually looked out into the crowd and saw a
banner – actually, Jacques sold it in the last auction. And it said, “We love
Lydia,” and I’m going, “Oh my God.” And then there was a little banner back by
itself, hanging from the rafters in the back of the Garden, and all I did was
cry. I could not stop. The tears were just pouring down my face. When they
played, the ovation that the audience gave them, the claps for encores and
everything … it was just amazing. I mean, my family was there, my friends, my
relatives … it was just an amazing … I mean, Bill Aucoin was right near me, and
I was crying on his shoulder (laughs).
After all you’d been
through those nine years, hearing “Beth” for the first time must have brought
out a flood of emotions.
LC: Well, that
was more like 11 years by that time (laughs). It was more like ’76, I guess.
They played the Garden in ’76 or ’77 … no, ’77. So maybe it was about 10 years.
It was just unbelievable. Him singing “Beth,” every time he’d come out, he’d
bow to me (laughs). He’d actually stop at the sound board, because I’d be
standing at the sound board, and he would bow to me and then go. But he would
never throw a rose to me. He would always want to give them to the fans. And he
would never let me stand in the pit. That was another thing. I could have had a
lot more photos if he would have let me be in the pit. The pit is right below
the stage where all the photographers stayed. He would not let me go because it
was too dangerous.
He did have a
paranoid side to him, didn’t he?
LC: Very paranoid,
yes.
I wanted to ask you
about going overseas. What was your favorite memory of going to Japan?
LC: Just being in
Japan. I’ve been to Japan twice – once in ’77 and once in ’78. But just being
in Japan was
amazing because I never in my life ever thought … I never dreamed
of being married to a rock star. I just dreamed of being a little Italian
housewife that raised four kids and grew up and all I did was cook all day. I
never dreamed of going to Japan. That wasn’t one of my dreams. I never dreamed
of being an author. I never dreamed of publishing my own book – never dreamt
that, but I did it, and I believe if I put my mind to anything, I can do it.
Going to Japan was one of my favorite, favorite things because you just see how
the other side of the world lives. And you think it’s so much different than
the way you do, and sometimes it really isn’t. It’s like they still have the
same … you think they’re so far behind the times, and really, they’re more
ahead of the times than we are. I mean, just the fact that I could buy cameras
so much cheaper than you can buy them here … you know, I bought my Nikon and that
was my first camera that was a professional camera. I bought that there. Peter
told me to go out and buy a $2,000 fur coat, so instead I went out and bought a
$500 Nikon.
It paid off for you.
LC: I know it
did, because eventually, I wind up working in a photo agency. She was also my
agent. I was her friend. We used to travel together, the boss that owned the
photo agency. And I was also her bookkeeper.
Oh, is that right?
LC: And now, I’m
[rock photographer] Bob Gruen’s bookkeeper. You know, Bob Gruen? The John
Lennon New York City t-shirt?
Sure, sure.
LC: You know, he
did Dressed to Kill.
That’s right.
LC: I’m his
bookkeeper. Well, actually, right now I’m panicking, because it is tax time and
I have to get back to bookkeeping.
I have to ask you
about the People’s Choice Awards. That must have been a nerve-wracking
experience.
LC: That was such
a nerve-wracking experience, you have no idea. Okay, they knew they were
getting the People’s Choice Award. That’s one award that you’re told beforehand.
That’s why everybody who gets it usually shows up. For some reason, KISS only
found out 10 days before, so they couldn’t show up. They were already booked in
Fargo, North Dakota. They said, what are we going to do, sit in the audience
with makeup on? We’re going to feel ridiculous and blah, blah, blah … so I’m
sitting at a table backstage in Detroit with Gene, Peter and Bill Aucoin, and I
just said, “Well, I’ll accept the award,” just joking. And Gene turned out and
said, “Okay.” And once I knew he said, “Okay,” I said, “Oh my God.” I lost 10
pounds in 10 days. I was a nervous wreck. I had to get a dress, I had to get
hair, I had to figure out what to do with my hair, I had to get nails … I
didn’t even have long nails. I had to get them, fake nails. I had to do the
whole thing, and I was a nervous wreck. I had to give a speech. Not only that,
but they stuck me in the audience and they never told me when to walk up. They
never told us. There was nothing. They never told
me anything. And Bill Aucoin
was sitting next to me and he just pushes me out. I was sitting on the aisle.
He just pushes me out, and he goes, “Good luck.” And I’m going, “Bill, I’m
going to kill you (laughs).”
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| "Beth" - Peter Criss |
Were you able to do
the entire speech as written?
LC: Yeah, yeah. I
mean, I’ve done this speech so much, I know it by heart: “Honestly, ‘Beth’ is
my favorite song, not only because it’s how Peter feels about me, but it’s how
everyone feels when he’s away from the woman he loves. KISS is performing
tonight and they just want me to thank you for this great honor, and I want to
thank KISS.” And then I blew a little kiss.
That was a nice
touch.
LC: Yeah, I think
Carl Glickman or Howard Marks wrote it for me. He wrote that for me. And I
practiced. I said it over and over again on the plane. The week before, I used
to carry it around with me, practicing it for 10 days. All I ate for 10 days
was an egg a day.
Is that right?
LC: I was
nauseous. I couldn’t eat anything, and I was stuck … I would try to eat
something, so I would have a hard-boiled egg, and I was like full just from
eating that. And I was a nervous wreck. And I think I went down to 103 pounds
the day of the People’s Choice Awards.
What was the most
frustrating thing for Peter about being in KISS?
LC: Well, he was
frustrated because he couldn’t get enough songs on the albums, but the thing
was, Peter’s songs are not as good as Gene’s and Paul’s. That’s the problem
Peter doesn’t realize. He thinks his songs are great and they’re not. I mean,
I’m sorry to say it, but I mean, “Beth” is good and some of the songs were
good, but he also wrote them with Stan Penridge. And Penridge was really the
writer. You know, for some reason I think you have to know music … not really,
no – because Richie [Fontana, formerly of Piper] doesn’t. You don’t have to
read music, but you know … playing guitar might help. I don’t know, but my
boyfriend, Richie, he’s an amazing writer. Peter wasn’t – sorry, sorry.
How would you
characterize your marriage to Peter? It seemed like you had to play
psychologist quite a bit.
LC: Well, to be
honest with you, I thought we had a good marriage. We did fight, but I thought
everybody fought. And you know what it is? I realize now everybody doesn’t
fight, because I think you fight when you’re younger because you’re just too
immature. Richie and I, we’ve been together 11 years, and we’ve had two fights.
That’s it. Two fights in 11 years. And they weren’t major … well, one was
major, and one, neither one of us know what the fight was about (laughs). “Why
did we have that fight?” We don’t even remember. Anyway, one was a major fight,
but the thing is when you’re young, you fight a lot more. You’re jealous.
You’re immature. Richie’s been through … do you know who Richie is?
Richie Fontana?
LC: Yes. He’s
been on the road with a major band, Piper. He was with the Skatt Bros., which
was Sean
Delaney. He’s had a great career. He was on Paul Stanley’s album, the
solo album. And he was a drummer, but he also plays every other instrument.
He’s like a McCartney, like a McCartney of the Aucoin people. You know, we
don’t fight. We’ve both been through it all, we both know … hey, we’re mature.
I know he’s gone out with girls. He knows I’ve gone out with guys. What are you
going to do, fight about the past? But that’s the thing: Peter was always
jealous, and he says I was jealous, but of course, I was jealous because he
admits he was cheating on me. Why shouldn’t I be jealous?
 |
| Richie Fontana - Piper |
Was it the drugs that
changed Peter? Or was it the success? Or was it all of it?
LC: No, that’s
what broke up our marriage. You know what I used to say to Peter? I’ll be
honest with you. I used to say to Peter, “Look, I know you’re a rock star now.
And I know you’ve got lots of girls all over, hanging all over you. And I’m
sure you sleep with some of them. Just don’t take them to breakfast.” In other
words, “Don’t flaunt them in front of your band members. Do your thing and get
rid of them.” Debbie, obviously, he didn’t get rid of. And he wound up marrying
her. I believe that it was all … at that point, drugs were a major part of our
life, and that’s what really broke us up. I really believe that. It wasn’t the
girls, because I knew he was with girls. It was the drugs.
It seems like him and
Ace … I don’t know if they kind of ran together, but they seemed to be
interested in the same things.
LC: The thing is
… it’s not that they ran together, because they kind of didn’t. Yeah, Peter
hung out with Paul a lot. We went on vacation together, twice. Once we went to
Rockport, Mass., which is kind of like Martha’s Vineyard in a way. It’s near
there. And then we also met in Hawaii together – me, Paul and Peter and
whatever girl he was with at the time. I never actually went on vacation with
Ace. So, it wasn’t like … I was closer to Jeanette [Trerotola, Ace Frehley’s
former wife] than … well, actually, Paul had a girlfriend I was close to as
well. But I’m not sure. I know we used to go out to clubs with Paul, because
Paul lived in the city, but we were actually closer to Paul at one point. But I
think that people think that Ace and Peter were close, but just because they
both drank but it wasn’t necessarily that way.
Peter did have his
wild friends like John Belushi.
LC: Yeah, we had
John, but so did Ace. Ace knew John, but the thing is we were introduced by
another friend of mine that used to do videos for KISS. We were introduced to
John, and also, Sean Delaney worked with John Belushi. Yeah, Sean did work on
“Saturday Night Live.”
What was the scariest
moment for you with Peter?
LC: Um, when he
would get violent. There were a few times. There was a time where I got hit by
him. Three o’clock in the morning, we’re living in Brooklyn, KISS is doing
their first album. Richie Wise and Kenny Kerner [the producers on KISS’s debut
album] were joking with him, and they said, “Oh, Lydia’s flirting with Paul,”
just because I was taking pictures and because they wanted to bust his balls.
But he came home drunk and he wanted to beat me up, so he did. He punched me in
the lip, and I had to go to work the next day and make an excuse for that one. That
was scary. The other scary one was in my apartment in Manhattan, when we moved
to the east side of Manhattan. I don’t know, we were having some sort of fight,
and I wound up leaving and I checked into a hotel. And the other time was …
there was another time he was hitting me, but basically … oh, we were on the
road and I actually left the room and knocked on Bill Aucoin’s door and said,
“Can I sleep in here,” and I did. At that point, Peter was wrecking the room,
and I have photos of it.
In the end, you
didn’t end up divorcing just Peter. You divorced KISS pretty much and your
previous life.
LC: That’s the
hardest part of getting divorced. You don’t leave a person. You leave their family,
you end up losing their friends, and their business associates. Fortunately, I
kept in touch with Ace. I’m not in touch with Gene or Paul. I see them
occasionally, maybe once every 20 years … I don’t know (laughs). But I do talk
to his family. I’m close to his family, his brother. I’m closer to his brother
now than he is. He hasn’t talked to his brother in about 15 years. He only
talks to one of his sisters, and the last time I saw Peter, which was at Bill
Aucoin’s memorial, I had to tell him it was his sister’s … the one sister that
he does keep in touch with I had to tell him it was her birthday.
Oh, is that right?
LC: I said, “You
should call your sister.” The family is always complaining, “We don’t hear from
him. We don’t hear from him.” So I tell him, and I have seen him in 16 years
and I’m reprimanding him (laughs).
Learning how to be a
photographer, did you ever think that would help you stand on your own two
feet?
LC: Well,
absolutely. I always loved being a photographer. My mother took pictures and my
uncle was a professional photographer. My uncle actually built his own camera
and he was in a photography magazine. He always had a Leica, which I wound up
getting when he passed away. But my mother always used to go, “Oh no. Here
comes aunt Mary with the camera.” And that was my mother. So I always had a
camera, and when I finally was getting divorced, I’m going to go for lessons,
because we had finally gotten professional cameras. And you know, you can learn
a little bit through … you know, once we were in Japan they were telling me
what to do with this camera and I’m going,”Ugh. I’m like lost.” But I went to
school. I went to school, to the New School in New York City, and I took a
couple of classes. Jeanette was supposed to go with me, but she bailed out. And
so I took a couple of classes, and I learned how to use the camera. And I just
said to myself … I just remember walking in my home in Greenwich, and I
thought, “You know what? Your life is not over. You can do whatever you want to
do, and you’re going to do it.” I just said, “I want to be a photographer.” And
that’s what I became.
Who was your favorite
band to photograph?
LC: Ah, Queen.
Queen. Well, KISS would have been if they’d allowed me to be in the pit, but I
wasn’t allowed because of Peter. It wasn’t KISS; it was Peter who didn’t want
me there. But Queen has the best lighting. I loved their lighting. I mean, I’m
not sure, but I’m sure KISS had great lighting also. I mean, I love to
photograph KISS. They’re so visual. But other than KISS, it would be Queen.
Was there a photo
that you’ve taken over the years, maybe of Freddie [Mercury] or somebody,
that’s your favorite?
LC: Oh yeah. I
got a picture of Freddie where he’s standing with his fist out and he’s
standing sideways and the lights from something on the stage just keep going.
It’s an amazing photo and the weirdest thing about it is [famed rock
photographer] Barry Levine asked me for a copy of that photo.
Oh, is that right?
LC: So, you know
who Barry is, right?
He taught you a few
tricks, right?
LC: Barry is my
inspiration, and so is Bob Gruen. They both inspired me. Barry inspired me with
his professionalism and his creativity. Bob Gruen inspired me with respect to
you can do anything and they’ll love it (laughs). I said to Bob Gruen, “I have
a photo in my book … some of them are dark, some of them are out of focus.” He
goes, “It doesn’t matter. They’ll love them anyway.” I didn’t want them in my
book, but my editors said, “Put them in the book. They’re history. They’re part
of history (laughs).”
Do you have a
favorite Ace story you could tell? It seems like there is a lot of them.
LC: Well, you
know the one of him with the girl on the balcony.
Right.
LC: Jesus, I
don’t know. I think Ace is a story in himself. He’s a character. Oh, all right.
I’ve got a story about Ace. I probably don’t have it in the book. Okay … well,
maybe I do. I’m not sure. Anyway, Ace is here one day. He’s at my apartment,
and he’s going over to see this girl Linda, who lives on 72nd. I’m
like a couple of blocks away from there. A few blocks from the Dakota. So he’s
going over to see Linda, and he goes, “Lydia, could you lend me $20?” I said,
“$20? What the hell are you going to do with $20?” And he says, “Oh, you know,
just in case I need $20.” I said, “Ace, I’ll give you $50.” So I went over the
safe and got $50 out of the safe and I gave him $50, and he goes, “Hey, you got
a lot of money?” And I said, “No, but I’ve got money.” And he goes, “Will you
marry me?”
And he likes to
gamble.
LC: Needless to
say, I never got the $50 back (laughs). He loves to gamble. I was at his
apartment once. It was me and Jeanette. We were at the apartment, and he took a
Lear jet to Atlantic City, and he called up Jeanette. And he says, “Jeanette,
I’m not coming home tonight.” She goes, “What do you mean?” We were in his
Manhattan apartment. He had a house at that point I think up it was up in
Irvington, New York. It was just a rental. Or maybe he owned it. I’m not sure.
He might have owned it. I’m not sure, but it wasn’t the big house that he
bought in Wilson, New York. He goes, “I’m not coming home.” And she goes, “Why
not?” And he says, “Because I’m winning $40,000. I’m up $40,000. And I’m not
coming home. We’re rained in.” And she goes, “Okay, fine.” He winds up … the
next day he takes the plane out and comes home with $25,000. She goes, “What
happened to the other $15,000?” And he goes, “Well, I lost it. And I also
bought you a mink coat (laughs).” He’s hysterical.
He hasn’t changed
much, except for the sobriety I suppose.
LC: Yeah.
Look for more of our interview with Lydia Criss in the coming days. In the meantime, visit http://www.lydiacriss.com/ for more information on Lydia and the revised and expanded edition of her book, “Sealed with a KISS.”
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Look for more of our interview with Lydia Criss in the coming days. In the meantime, visit http://www.lydiacriss.com/ for more information on Lydia and the revised and expanded edition of her book, “Sealed with a KISS.”
